Has an affiliate ever been prosecuted?!

[heatherhab]

Does anyone know or ever heard of an affiliate of an OP(just involved in marketing the site!) being prosecuted or sued by anyone?! If this going to be a reality with all of the bad pr, this is not worth it! Or will they go after the OPs and the doctors writing illegal prescriptions?! Makes more sense to me!


I know being ignorant usually does not keep you out of jail but I am only going on what my affiliate director is telling me.Aslong as I have in writing that they onlyuse US licensed pharmacists, do not ship to Nevada, etc. etc., am I safe? Should I put a legal waiver on my site? Have any of you done that?


Signed,


Paranoid(is it over before I even made the big bucks?!)http://rxaffiliate.web104.discountasp.net/smileys/smiley28.gif

[phalaris]

Good question. I have also thought about it butlegal dogs (read lawyers) are most likely to go after people with big money first but this doesn't mean we are immune from legal action if someone died using meds sold on our site. Edited by: phalaris

[redex]

I doubt that would ever happen unless you sold xanax valium, hydro or some other drug that someone's son OD'd on and died. You may not legally be liable, but as OJ Simpson found out, it could clean your pockets in a wrongful death civil suit.

[DEWIE42]

Gawd I thought I would never find my way back here lol...well while referring to the Hydro,xanax,valium and diazepam...I really wish Brian from MWS would come here and post about this....I certainly dont want to have the DEA knocking at my door smileys/smiley19.gif

[redex]

Heheh, he is prolly over at the old board with everyone else. Seems it is still active (I don't know why)

[redex]

Hey DEWIE, your avatar looks like sh*t!

[manager]

All this mess will be worked out tongiht. We finally have the right software running for this server. Although its not PhpBB(Yet...) there won't be any down time. People probably still have the access version in their cache. BUt by otnight it'll look the same as the old board with the same function and you'll be able to get her straight from rxaffiliateforum.com

[DEWIE42]

Yo Redex I am working on it....its prolly still back at the other active Form lolsmileys/smiley2.gif

[DEWIE42]

Guess not lol.....gawd don't want to lose my money...like my mindsmileys/smiley2.gif

[manager]

We're on it DEWIE, active users, top posters, and that psoting error are next smileys/smiley16.gif

[MWS_Brian]

I hope I am posting.


If I was an affiliate and had a site in my name or my companys name, I would have EVERYTHING in writing with my Op(s)


I would also verify my OP has a letter of opinion and that I could review it.


That being said, andyone with sites in their own name or company could be and most liley will be sued of something happens. Fact of life, and noone could tell you otherwise.


Think if you want to go after someone in this biz, what would you do ? Sue everyone and then find the money right ?


I have mentioned a few times in other threads about being careful. I have posted guilelines before. I am on AIM at mwsguy if you ever want to talk.


SEMI-SIDENOTE


I think it would help ot have live chats on this type of thing. Admin, I know you are jamming, but is the an IRC plugin you could add ? i would be happy to answer all questions...

[manager]

Brian we are lookin at chat mods as we speak and plan on adding one tomorrow or thursday.

[iggy]

<<That being said, andyone with sites in their own name or company could be and most liley will be sued of something happens.>>

you must be taking too many of those extra hydros.

That is a ridiculous statement, to say that if "something happens", most likely the affiliate will be sued.

Maybe you should add that you have 0 legal knowledge personally and are not at all familiar with criminal or civil law as a rep of your company.

Also, you are only strengthening the view of MANY here that it's time to go to comparison sites where we do not take orders but link to OP's. This way the customer will have ordered right from the OP's site and our hands are clean.

Interesting approach to making the affiliates here feel secure working with you.Edited by: iggy

[Affiliate]

Iggy, I think Brain is talking about co-branded sites.


I don't know anything about Brian's legal knowledge but I think his lawyers would fall over if they saw somehis posts. I appreciateBrian being open on the forum but it does make me think ifhe really have a team of lawyers or not.


Edited by: Affiliate

[rxmary]

If I buy a power tool from a commissioned salseman at Sears and it somehow malfunctions and results in a lost limb....do I sue the salesman? Sears? Or do I sue the product manufacturer.


I see us affiliates as the salesman in the above scenerio, and just cannot believe any lawyer would even look at us, except in trying to determine who we advertised for.


Tort lawyers would not go after affiliates straight out(not to say they may not be "party" to a lawsuit), but they really will go after the doctors, OPs, and pharmacies that ship it.Edited by: rxmary

[MedsDirect]

<DIV>


A couple things,


First, in defense of Brian (even though we are competitors): I have spoken to Brian on many occasions and can say that he has an in depth knowledge of the legal atmosphere ( possibly as in depth as a non-Lawyer can have)as it pertains to his business.


One of the main Lawyers on Brians legal team is also on my legal team, and I can tell you that this firm is THE authority on online pharmacies. In fact, their client list spans the majority of legitimate (read legally operating) online pharmacies out there. These guys specialize in the industry.


It is important to understand that neither Brian nor myself are lawyers, but as employees, and at least in my case, shareholders in a couple of the largest online pharmacies out there, we are as informed about our businesses legality as we can possibly be. Statements by Brian, myself or another OP repmake are not legal advice (that's not our area of expertise) but it is our best translation/understanding of the legal advice we've been given. We don't pay legal fees in excess of $300.00 an hour to sit in the dark when our names, personal assets and family income are on the line.


Second item: There is a big difference between being sued, and being found guilty. Anyone can sue anyone in a frivolous lawsuit or otherwise. Merely defending yourself in that lawsuit (even if you are guaranteed to win) can cost thousands of dollars. Especially if you need to defend yourself in the court of another state (travel expenses). For all that Affiliate Marketers may be totally protected legally (though that's up to the lawyers to advise on and the courts to decide) someone can bring suit against you, just as easily as if you were an affiliate salesman for staplers, drug into a carpel tunnel(sp.?) suit. You may be perfectly covered legally, or found free of liability, or receive a summary judgment in your favor, but regardless, you can be sued (costing money for defense.) Our goals as OPs is to provide for ourselves and our affiliates as much legal evidence, contracts and sound operating procedures as possible so that in the case of a lawsuit (however unfounded it may be) we can have an expedient defense, and hopefully a summary judgment in our and our affiliates favor.


This is where the affiliate contracts and letter of opinion that Brian mentions are so important. By providing prosecutors, DEA, FDA, and courts with immediate and sound legal documents, showing that we understand and obey the laws, they can (and do) assess the legality of our operations whenever necessary.


As a matter of fact, some of the brick and mortar pharmacies that service the big OPs (I know at least that they handle a portion of our and Brians business) receive regular, open inspections by the DEA, and have a communicative open door policy with them. They are cleared by the DEA on a regular basis for the medications they ship, and the methods by which those prescriptions are given and transferred (including prescriptions based solely on an online questionnaire, providing it is for qualifying medications with Doctors registered and operating from states that allow it).


At this point, the concern shouldn't be whether or not the "industry" is dying. Recently there has been an outburst of OPs that openly break the law. Selling dangerous drugs, without proper protocol and committing various felonies all along the way. Some sign prescriptions with the Doctors name, having never had the questionnaire reviewed by a Doctor. Others are run by convicted felons, or operate without licensed pharmacies, or have non pharmacists filling and shipping prescriptions etc. The concern should be whether or not YOUR OP fulfillment is handled by a legitimate company that is fully certified and operating legally (Doctors, Pharmacists and Health Professionals that are properly Licensed in the states they are in and the states they service, as well as all of the other various factors.)


No one but the Supreme court can guarantee

[drugsdr]

Aaron thanks for the post and keeping us up to date with whats been happening over the last few days from an OP perspective.



The thanks also extends to Brian, both of you have done a good job
keeping us up to date and offering insight in whats happening in the
industry.

[redex]

If I buy a power tool from a commissioned salseman at Sears and it somehow malfunctions and results in a lost limb....do I sue the salesman? Sears? Or do I sue the product manufacturer.


If you are looking for money, all three. If the salesman remotely related that this tool is safe, you would definitely name him as the cause of losing a limb.


Not sure if you live in the US rxmary, (I heard rumors otherwise smileys/smiley4.gif) but we are a sue happy bunch here. Someone sued McDonalds because the hot coffee they got in the drive through spilled on their lap and burned them - THEY WON!


A burgular was breaking into a home in California trying to gain access through a roof skylight, fell through the skylight, sued the home owners AND WON!


A good point to consider is, do international boundries protect affiliates in foreign countries and are they immune to US laws and regulations. As a US based OP affiliate, I feel sure my chances of being dragged into court are far better than an affiliate in the UK or Australia.

[rxmary]

Yes, Redex - US citizen and a former Florida resident, I might add smileys/smiley2.gif


I just know that in Tort class and from working with and for attorneys - they go after the big money. So yes, I agree that we could be dragged into a suit or named as a party in a civil case, but I DO NOT believe that any attorney in his right mind is going to just single me out and sue me individually. I feel pretty certain, but I also have been putting a lot of money into 529's for my kids and trusts and other vehicles which basically don't count as "Mine" in the event anyone would want to look and see what they could get - but later on, I can always have access to it again (after I pay all taxes that is). Of course I could always incorporate and cover my ass too.


Oh, and the McDonalds Suit - they sued McDonalds, not the employee who took the order and poured the coffee.

[redex]

Good point, I will have to look into trusts as no kids heading fro college here. I would just hate to spend thousands of dollars in legal feesand days in court just to clear my name.

[iggy]

Brian,

Why would someone join your affiliate program when you tell them that if anything happens they will most likely get sued?

The point is, with that attitude it just pushes more and more of the major players away from taking the orders and towards promoting sites like E-scripts, etc...where we simply link to their site.

The chances are "next to none" that your site will be remembered in a suit or prosecution if the customer did not even order from your site.

[MWS_Brian]

Sorry, I am not trying to scare you all. i am just saying the truth.


Put it this way, that Sears is not a good analogy.


Lets say i went to you house and said I work for mybiz.com ( a site I own, and a business I own) and represent that company, and that company sells you a blender.


Now, blender breaks, who they calling FIRST? The business(website) owner.


How many of you on your wbesites say you are an affiliate of xyz.com ?


Or how many of you say come to myrxsite.com becuse you wanted to brand ?


Sorry, I am telling you the truth.


I URGE you all to toalk to you own attorneys or get marketing aggreements with your OPs.


I am not saying you WILL bee sued, I am saying legally what your attorneys would say. Any attoneys here who can reply ?

[amdanex]

Brian,


Your thinking could by right, but if this is the case all the affiliates industry in the Internet will need a regulation platform very soon.


Even OP's are sellingmedications, legally is not very different to sell webhosting for example. If the host company fails in the service, under your point, the affiliate could be in troubles.


Of course no one person will be in health riskbuying hosting. I'm talking only about aff. liability.


I can share your thinking, but in my opinion in the OP's industry, I'll need as an affiliate to agree some aditional disclaimer in my sites.


I don't think that aff. sites linking to the merchant or co-branded sites will have different liability in this point.


In our industry thereal matter is if we areworking with reliables companies, taking care about prescriptions, delivery etc.


Even I'm only a worker in this field, my guess is that in a near future we'll see a strong regulation anda very limited number of OP's dealing in the market with the enough capability to fullfill all the rules. And perhaps........minuscommissions, to solve the newexpenses ??.


Online casinos are a 100% offshore industry , andno USA jobs are involved. However the discussion in the US about this topic has years.


Asuming that OP's are a national industry with many people working on it,I think that we are in the verge of a long discussion.


Best Regards

[iggy]

&lt;&lt;How many of you on your wbesites say you are an affiliate of xyz.com ?&gt;&gt;

Nearly all of us will soon.

You are missing the point. The point is that if the customer orders from e-scipts or the like, as you say, they will go after them. If we partner with a OP that makes us have our own order form we are at a lot more risk.

This is why it is YOUR job to protect the affiliates unless you want to lose them all...

[pudding]

I wouldn't worry about lawsuits, the DEA has your number, They got massive amounts of data on those raids.



DEA don't play nice.

[redex]

And everyone hiding behind proxy registrars better hope they had a proxy payee on their commission checks to LOL

[BummerT]

I wouldn't worry about lawsuits, the DEA has your number, They got massive amounts of data on those raids.

DEA don't play nice.



Yeah, I'm sure theygot a hold of who the checks were being written out to. If you work with EVA, they know who you are.

[iggy]

&lt;If you work with EVA, they know who you are.&gt;

Why EVA? I believe all OP's write checks.

man, paranoia running out of control. The dea has not even pressed criminal charges against the owners of the pharmacy or the OP's. Why would they waste their time with affiliates?

[BummerT]

&lt;If you work with EVA, they know who you are.&gt;

Why EVA? I believe all OP's write checks.

man, paranoia running out of control. The dea has not even pressed criminal charges against the owners of the pharmacy or the OP's. Why would they waste their time with affiliates?


Well, what do you think the DEA walked out with? Lollypops and candy?


I was told that the DEA grabbed payment info. Doctors, suppliers, affiliates, etc.

[redex]

Well, what do you think the DEA walked out with? Lollypops and candy? I was told that the DEA grabbed payment info. Doctors, suppliers, affiliates, etc.


You spreading rumors again, Bummer? http://www.rxaffiliateforum.com/smileys/smiley8.gif


I did not read anywhere about EVA getting raided? Lifeline only deals in thecustomer side of EVA, not the vendors (affiliates).

[Shark Attack]

This forum is great for information and MIS-information

[iggy]

LOL - You heard that huh bummer?

[scottdaman]

YES! http://rxaffiliate.web104.discountasp.net/smileys/smiley15.gif


EVERYONE CLOSE YOUR SITES NOW! smileys/smiley8.gif

[redex]

If you are trafficking controlled substances, they have to take your car, house and all other assets. You ae going to lose it all. smileys/smiley3.gif

[iggy]

&lt;If you are trafficking controlled substances, they have to take your car, house and all other assets. You ae going to lose it all.&gt;

Looks like your screwed than redex cause i guarantee you have sold some if you partner with anyone that sells diet pills smileys/smiley2.gif

I guess you can say you only sold a little and didn't mean to...